oh ya, there’s one i left off…

what about all you rich colombo types “employing” children to be servants… do you know how many thousand child slaves there are in colombo that are worked to the bone, beaten, and sexually abused day in and day out…

why do you care so much about a relatively small population who may or may not be joining the LTTE voluntaraly???

i’m sure if you had family members who were killed by GoSL when you were 15 or 16 you’d join up…

is the crime of recruiting or allowing “child soldiers” to enroll/join more of a crime than the GoSL:
1) depriving the children of the NE of proper healthcare, nutrition, education
2) bombing and shelling and raping and killing children in the NE
3) assisting in the abduction of children for the Karuna group
4) ignoring the 60,000 odd children who are child prostitues in the south…?

why not the same rightous indignation about these things…
???

HRW

Perhaps the issue of child soldiers is a topic that has brought the woodorms out. I think it has been a subject that the public have responded to with more passion than other HR abuse issues (yes, we know crimes have been abundantly committed by both sides). So perhaps the majority of people don’t see ALL moral issues in the same light, but this is one that a lot of people have taken offense with. What I’m hearing from people is “there needs to be a line and this might be the point where the line has been stepped over”. The reality is that not all moral issues are being judged in the same light, andit is a matter of opinion what is acceptable and what is. Perhaps I get on my high horse and am offended by everything (whilst still paying my taxes and not jumping up to throw myself infront of any bullets); perhaps other people (like yourself) can see all transgressions it in the context of a war and find it acceptable; others, however, may feel that as a government who has been holding itself above the LTTE as an elected representative of the people, this is the issue that may tip the balance into the realms of the unacceptable. It is a matter of opinion, and the science of ethics is a subjective one.

There’s a difference, Billy, between disagreeing with the govt and claiming that their behaviour is reprehensible or indefensible. If their behaviour is that abhorrent, you should not be paying taxes to support that behaviour.

Of course, I understand that 90% of humanity wants someone else to take the risks so that we can be ethical, and I didn’t expect you to be different. But I’d like to see some perspective here when the moral high horse is brought out of its stable. It’s all very well to decide that ALL moral issues must be dealt with equally, but that’s not the reality of it, is it?

In response to the tax rupees argument, I suppose there are a number of ways of putting one’s money where one’s mouth is but I don’t think that is really what we are discussing. Are you suggesting that all those not in favour of the government stop paying their taxes immediately? I don’t know if you are being serious or just having a bit of a dig. I think there have always been things that GoSL have done that I find indefensible but one still has to exist in this country – there are grounds for not paying taxes for the last couple of decades I’d say, not just over this instance. Of course I choose well-being over morality, or I’d be like Raviraj and end up dead on the pavement. Instead I’m sitting on my arse writing anonymously on a blog – not a great act of heroics by any stretch of the imagination. But if we all have to be principled heroes to have a point of view then there’d be about 5 people allowed to air their views on anything. What point are you trying to make? Anyone who pays their taxes has no right to criticise the government for potentially supporting/facilitating the use of child soldiers?

“GoSL has shown that it prefers well being to morality” – how does that work exactly? Not being facetious, just don’t follow. Their own personal well being I assume? Is this some kind of false logic to lead us to the conclusion we are all the same? Because most people don’t want to die for our principles then we are all as bad as murderers and have no right to judge/criticise anyone? Come on DB, is that any way to analyse a problem?

On the right to demand that the government of my country not support child recruitment and pick its allies better, I have question. Do you realise, Billy, that YOU support child recruitment through your tax rupees, some of which are being used to fund the TMVP? Therefore, would you be willing to stop paying taxes on moral grounds and run the risk of prosecution? If you feel morality is more important than personal well being, you should put it into practice. The GoSL has clearly shown that it prefers well being to morality, and in this case I agree with them.

“The GoSL has done stuff far worse than this. If the UN (and you) want this to change, you have to find a way to get real evidence — pix, film footage, eyewitnesses who’ll testify before a UN body — whatever. Until then, you might as well piss at the moon, ‘cos nothing will happen ”

Agreed, to be honest sometimes I feel that all the peacebuilding efforts that have been going on for the last 30 years have been the equivalent of pissing at the moon.

My argument is that, whether it is a deliberate strategy or the anomolous actions of only a few individuals, it needs to be addressed, investigations need to be made, and allegations need to be answered. Perhaps that’s where your point of view and mine differ.

“So if then your argument is that we should pick our allies better, that might be worthy of discussion. ”
That wasn’t my original argument, but you are right in saying that this is a point that sorely needs to be discussed.

End the war, Billy, and child recruitment will end.

Not for “whatever reason”, Vat2do, for the LTTE reason. The LTTE said, no, you don’t deserve democracy yet, folks. Just do as we say. We want war. We want Mahinda. So don’t vote, ‘cos we know you’ll vote for Ranil & peace. The NE Tamils buckled. So in the end, we ALL chose war. The Sinhalese by voting, the Tamils by not voting.

Was there a point to your post, though, other than your usual “it’s not the Tamils’ fault, it’s all the silly Sinhalese fault”?

Surprise, surprise, the government has been blocking all meaningful attempts at this. Of course they would because I can only imagine what conclusions such a commission will come up with. Then they’d be well and truly fucked. Better to maintain this environment of ambiguity and confuse the populace with counter allegations of deceit and propose watered down versions of the needed commission. Sounds like a familiar tactic doesn’t it? Sure GoSL’s been using that on the devolution debate for a while – coming up with the bright idea that we need to study the Panchyat system for a while first, what kind of a ridiculous evasion of the subject, side step was that???. If you keep farting about the issue like that and lying through your teeth it’s a great survival technique. 101 ways to look a little bit like you are doing something while you keep bombing the shit out of the nation.

If GoSL is so secure in the knowledge that it was in no way implicated why does it not allow and facilitate a full, independent investigation? How can irrefutable proof be provided without one?

the Tamils didn’t vote – for whatever reason and the sinhala south voted for war…. vat 2 do…

and by the way the people of the NE overwhelmingly voted for the TNA when they ran on a pro-LTTE as the voice of the tamils… Anandasangaree and others didn’t even get elected… and douglass only got 20,000 odd votes… 22 TNA – 1 EPDP

that’s ridiculous…
Sri lanka isn’t even a democracy… forget about the tamils in the NE, Mahinda won because thousands of UNP supports around the south were denied the ability to vote…

these petty, uneducated polititians and the colombo elite have only replaced the british as the colonial masters… they exploit their own people to further themselves and their “countrymen” while in office…

in the end though the question is:
what can you, the south, the sinhalese, really offer the LTTE or the Tamils as a political solution… No matter how much you disagree with the ISGA… IT WAS A STARTING POINT FOR A DIALOGUE which the GoSL refused to engage in… THERE HAS STILL NOT BEEN ANY COUNTERPROPOSAL.

Sorry? EMPHASIS on the war???? I don’t think the war NEEDS any further emphasis. It is the single biggest fuckup to ever land in Sri Lanka’s lap. Devolution isn’t the true prize for everyone. Those people caught in the middle, Billy, don’t care about devolution anymore than they care about unity. They care about war, and that it should stop. You can’t jump the war and try to move onto devolution, anymore than you can ignore devolution in order to fight the war.

“I’m really not interested in military tactical trade offs. Sacrifice a few tamil 13 year olds to the God of war so that we can gain some ground over here. Whatever. Where is it leading to?”

If you’re not interested in military tactics or strategy, you don’t go to war. War is all about gaining ground in one place or another. As I’ve repeated oft enough, war is bad, full stop. Everything that happens in war is bad. Death is bad. We (the majority of voters) decided we want war, not diplomacy. If you’re going to fight a war, you have to fight it effectively, not in a half-hearted manner. War is brutal, innocents die. But the idea of war is to win, thats why we use the Sri Lanka Army, and not the Salvation Army. If you’re not willing to fight to win, choose another part.

In the end, this GoSL has fought the war far better than past administrations, taking into account the restrictions imposed.

The issue at hand though is the credibility of a nation. And that needs to be jealously guarded. If someone showed me irrefutable proof (once again, within reason) that this was happening I will be very unhappy. But until they do I will be skeptical of the International Watchdogs who bark, often merely to remind the owner they’re there and need to be fed.

Maybe I was a bit overly cynical in my ‘hand-wringing’ statement. Sure, sending kids out to war is bad. But when you pick (for lack of a better word) allies, you need to be ready to accept that they aren’t always nice guys. Heck, even WE aren’t exactly nice guys. The end doesn’t justify the means, but SOME ends justify SOME means, and those decisions have to be taken.